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  • Hey Mixer, you should do booze for that.

Alcohol Healing Effects
Hey Mixer, you should do booze for that.

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So right now alcohol has effects on various aspects related to combat, that makes it unappetizing to use when injured in any capacity.

This is counter to the feel, I feel like the game is presenting to us. Currently the combatants including gangers, don't drink booze at all when injured, even when it might be in character to do so. And this creates a slightly awkward disjointed feel to alcohol as a system.

I'd propose, that in addition to the current effects, when injured, alcohol should provide a certain level of ghost healing or health. IE an ability to ignore wounds to a certain degree minor degree. Something so that if or as you got into combat you could soak a few extra minor hits or a couple major ones while injured without going unconscious. Or some other mechanical benefit too it, that might incentive its use over waiting in your apartment for 6 or so hours to go out after getting beat down while the last of the bruises fade. Hell a brawl might have a lull in the middle while people drank just to get brawling again, just getting more bruised up, stimulating the doctor economy.

It also provides a sort of minor, buffer, when you are injured, that you can go out and get into combat with, however, you run the risk of getting more injured than you normally might.

Bruised a rib?

Do booze for that

Papercut?

Put some booze on that.

Life threatening injuries?

See a doctor, and then do booze for that.

Hey Mixer, you should be doing booze for that.

I honestly don't know if this is possible but it's something that struck me as weird. When it's like someones all torn apart, and you see them all like, "NO! I DO NOT WANT BOOZE!" Fucking hell, don't want the cheapest painkiller in the mix then I take it. And this was my idea for a solution.

By RheaGhe at May 2, 2019 5:27 PM
It's an interesting idea,I know I've RP'd it a bit, would be interesting as a lower recovery, better pain tolerance mechanic.
By Varolokkur at May 2, 2019 5:30 PM
Yeah, having some function aside from a debuff would be a great way to put some extra chyen in low tier bartender pockets. It seems fairly common for people to forego drinking in bars entirely, aside from non-alcoholic drinks, and I've noticed that some players actively seek bars that sell coffee or otherwise. Of course, that might just be a character preference, but having a mechanic that reflects the positive reality of alcohol would be a great way to encourage getting chyen flowing, as well as making alcohol generally more useful.
By Espi at May 2, 2019 5:33 PM
Sounds game breaking. Alcohol is designed as a fairly minor and notably CHEAP resource. You want buffs - do drugs. They're costed out fairly and provide appropriate bonuses.
By ReeferMadness at May 2, 2019 5:37 PM
Hmmmm I kinda like the debuff. Maybe if it's a debuff until you drink enough to become drunk (then you feel invincible), but you'll be staggering around confused? Or maybe it could be the other way around (the proposed buff until you become drunk and then get a debuff).

I still like the debuff though.

By Diani at May 2, 2019 5:38 PM
Note this would be in addition to the debuff... So still have the debuff that current exists and stacked on top of it. At least with my idea. The devs might come up with something completely different.
By RheaGhe at May 2, 2019 5:39 PM
Rhea is proposing a trade off. It was already mentioned, you get slower recover like we already have, but it gives an increased pain threshold because alcohol is a drug that numbs pain.
By Varolokkur at May 2, 2019 5:46 PM
The only thing which incorporate pain tolerance in the game to my knowledge is cyberware. Should a 60 chyen drink really offer the same benefits?
By ReeferMadness at May 2, 2019 5:49 PM
No, not to the same degree, yes, to a similar much lesser effect.
By RheaGhe at May 2, 2019 5:49 PM
With a risk of alcohol poisoning if you have too much.
By Beepboop at May 2, 2019 5:50 PM
That I can agree with. Fuck booze already has way way too much risk for way too little reward.
By RheaGhe at May 2, 2019 5:51 PM
Booze already has way way too much risk for way too little reward.

Just like in real life?

I seriously just fail to see the point of asking the already limited coding hours to add minor bonuses which are already covered by both drugs and cyberware.

By ReeferMadness at May 2, 2019 5:56 PM
Alcohol is a blood thinner and decreases healing as well as you making bleed more.

Bad.

By HolyChrome at May 2, 2019 5:58 PM
But it also acts to dull pain. Remember, if booze is cheap and everyone can use it, then everyone can use it. it doesn't have to be nearly as strong as cyberware, and still has negative effects associated with it. The idea of having to find the "sweet spot" isn't bad either. You'll be less accurate and not be able to fight as well, but you might be able to take a couple more hits.

Sounds realistic to me.

By hello_marmalade at May 2, 2019 6:02 PM
Cheap things that everyone can use is not cyberpunk.

Things need to cost money, add value, be worth stealing, using, etc. This is the haves vs the have nots. Not lets all have a drink and wait for things to blow over at the Winchester.

The only caveat to this would be if the high end alcohols which cost as much or more so than drugs offered drug-like bonuses...but they already have other purposes.

By ReeferMadness at May 2, 2019 6:05 PM
So Reefer, your argument there would exclude...

Any drug from dispensers,

Wallets,

Proggy-7's if you buy at the right places,

Letters

Knives of various types,

Medkits.

These shouldn't exist? They are after all, cheap things that are valuable and worth stealing.

By RheaGhe at May 2, 2019 6:07 PM
All of those items cost in excess of 500 chyen with exception to letters. A written letter is most certainly more valuable.

A 60-150 chyen drink should not operate at that level.

By ReeferMadness at May 2, 2019 6:09 PM
You're wrong, but I can't say how wrong without breaking rules.

But let's just take a different tack here,

I'm not saying the effect should make you want to steal booze.

I'm saying the effect should make you want to PURCHASE, booze.

Because right now. I've sat in bars for 8-10 hours, and not seen a single person buy booze for someone. That wasn't a case of plying someone with RP bait.("Hey wanna RP with me, lemme get you a drink!")

By RheaGhe at May 2, 2019 6:11 PM
From someone

Correct that last bit to read

But booze from someone.

By RheaGhe at May 2, 2019 6:11 PM
So, maybe we should discuss the problem instead of the solution?
By ReeferMadness at May 2, 2019 6:12 PM
"I want Spurt soda to give me an energy boost and raise speed because it has lots of sugar and so I can powerchug a plastic dick before fights for RP."
By HolyChrome at May 2, 2019 6:14 PM
Reefer, it takes more than one drink to get drunk.

Also this is in line with reality, and I'd argue very cyberpunk. People get wasted in bars all the time, and follow it up with picking fights that they shouldn't, missing most of their shots, but taking more of a beating than they'd normally be able to because they can't feel it.

I suppose it doesn't explicitly need to be mechanical, but it's absolutely themely.

By hello_marmalade at May 2, 2019 6:16 PM
So you are saying you want to see less people buying alcohol? That is what you will get.
By Grizzly666 at May 2, 2019 6:18 PM
Just drink and fight and stop worrying about the numbers in the background.

No one's going to bars wondering what the optimal number of shots to take is.

Neither should you.

By HolyChrome at May 2, 2019 6:20 PM
Theme is fine. Style over substance all the way.

I'm very sensitive to fucking with the economy and giving people mechanics to abuse. The perks being proposed exist and are underutilized as it stands - therefore not really needed in my opinion.

Rhea brings up a very good point though of people not drinking in bars and I think this is the topic we should be discussing.

Is this because (Red Sector) bars are frequented by broke immigrants and avoided by flush oldbie's who don't want to be ambushed? Perhaps.

Is Slither's gossip system (requiring you to hold a drink) helping that? Maybe.

What other steps can we take to improve this? ICly I think a solid bartender can coerce the shit out of people to drink more.

Do we actually need people to be drinking more or is this an example of someone feeling the pain of being a broke bartender at a shitty mix dive bar? I think a little of both. Trickle down economy is sadly real in Sindome unlike real life. Oldbie daddy warbucks should be overtipping bartender and flexing there financial muscle. Is it happenning? I can't say.

By ReeferMadness at May 2, 2019 6:24 PM
The gossip system, at least for one of the bars that I've looked at, only functions if you're holding a drink and are the only person in the bar. It might function separately in other locations, or have been changed since I last tried it, but I think that's worth mentioning. It doesn't encourage buying from a player, or actually socializing when you hold that drink.

Even beyond the economic reason, I don't think it's unreasonable to conceptually have alcohol perform something other than a negative effect. Is it worth the development time to balance a positive effect with the existing negative, for characters of all power levels and stat types? Maybe not, on second thought.

But it's an idea for discussion.

By Espi at May 2, 2019 8:06 PM
I'm on the booze is a blood thinner. I have been injured before and the last thing on my mind was wanting to get drunk. Alcohol as a pain reliever is kinda the opposite of cyberpunk. The concept of it comes from a time when there was literally nothing else. In Withmore, there are plenty of pain relief drugs, cyberware, etc. I can appreciate the arguments being made here, but alcohol doesn't need benefits. The benefits are as an RP crutch. Your character drinks, gets loose lipped or more flirty, just like in real life. It's a social lubricant. If that isn't showing up ICly, it isn't a code problem really.
By Slither at May 4, 2019 10:04 AM
I don't think it'd be realistic. I know I'm not adding much here but alcohol is an archaic form of pain reliever. Alcohol definitely can make you bleed more so the opposite of what is suggested here would happen. When we have items and cyberware in-game to achieve what you suggested, paying 45c for a glass of lager to achieve the same result would be just way too cheap of a tactic.
By Rangerkrauser at May 4, 2019 10:07 AM
My personal opinion, formed from not much playing so bare with me, is that often times people enter bars supper unICly. If you enter a bar and just sit there without ordering anything everyone will look at you funny, even if you know its going to make you a bit tipsy. Also mentioned above if some well established pimp/fixer/ect walks into a bar and orders, say a coffee, that should indicate there scared and should loose street cred, or be branded as a cheap skate, or just generally not hold up that image.
By Smurfed at May 4, 2019 10:21 AM
Dunno if I agree with that, smudged. There are plenty of non drinkers who go to bars to socialize. Also bars are a safe-ish space to take a breather from the danger of the city, and are where a lot of connections are made. It makes sense that people wouldn’t be drinking every time they dropped in. Also there are plenty of characters that fit into a non-drinking persona that wouldn’t look weak or scared for not drinking. Perhaps it’s a solo who’s always hard boiled and ready to fight or something like that. Ordering a non-alcoholic drink makes sense. Hell I’ve seen that exact situation play out more than once IC.
By hello_marmalade at May 17, 2019 5:05 PM
That's... A really sillly idea, if I'm frank.

Why should my character be forced to drink alcoholic drinks if they're at a bar, if they don't drink? Like... As Marmalade said, I've seen it play plenty of times ICly, ordering a non-alcoholic drink made plenty of sense. Or the character just didn't like alcohol. I feel like people that don't drink alcohol aren't unthemely at all. Not sure why you'd make them "lose" street cred just because they don't want to drink alcohol.

By Kyrius00 at May 19, 2019 1:50 AM
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