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Repost: [Astrophel thread starting with cyberpunk Novels)

Originally posted by Astrophel...

Several times OOC I have discussed with various other playas background reading for both character and dome development.  These discussion typically center around the cyberpunk genre, and I fely it was time to pass some of this knowledge on to those who are less familiar with it.

With that in mind, there are two authors I strongly recommend reading.

Neal Stephenson:  Author of "Snowcrash" one of the best know, and best written works in the cyberpunk genre, this book helps give background ideas as to the realism of everyday life in the dome, even though it is not set in a post-apocalyptic wasteland.

Stephenson is also know for having written "Zodiac", "Diamond Age", "Cryptonomicon", "The Big U", (I keep thinking he wrote one more, and I've read it, but I sure con't remember what it is right now).  All of these are interesting reads, although he admits that "The Big U" isn't very good (its not, but its interesting to read anyway).  "Zodiac"was surprisingly entertaining for being an eco-thriller.  "Diamond Age" is a slow read, but its worth it, and it has a lot of potential in terms of rp ideas and development inside the dome.

William Gibson, probably the most famous name in cyberpunk, is known for "Neuromancer", "Johnny Mnemonic[sic]", "Virtual Light", "Count Zero" and several others.  All of his works that I have read (almost eveything he has written) are worth while.

Additionally, "Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep", the book that the movie Blade Runner was based on is a fascinating look at a portion of dome culture we've yet to truly deal with; and that is the genetic freaks and androids/cyborgs that may exist right now in the dome.

I have much more to discuss but little time to right, adieu.

Originally posted by Devi...

Recent good reads...  Fight Club by Chuck Palahnuck (Sp?), which actually made WAY more sense than the movie.
Originally posted by Astrophel...

The book of Fight Club is quite good, and along those lines i recommend reading Palahiuk's other two books; "Survivor" and "Invisible Monsters".  Both of them are pretty messed up, kinda like how "Fight Club" is pretty messed up, but they are messed up in their own unique ways so it isn't like rereading "Fight Club".
Read them, tell me what you think.  If I am online in the dome, contact me OOC, and I will usually be very willing to go @ooc to discuss any of this with anyone.  As long as I have time.
Johnny made some in-game books.
They's at the 'trix.

open -name-
read -name-
page -next/back- in -name-

and a few other commands. Cool :)

(Edited by Gally at 7:34 pm on Mar. 24, 2001)

In addition to the books johnny has made I have made a couple from material at different times.  They are basically just an item without any real unigue properties outside of the "clothing" type properties.  I found that by creating them though they were usable rp wise, since it was reasonable to give them to someone and have them read it, then you coudl rp like it was a real book. Additionally, since I set @wear messages for them, you could see that someone was reading the book, and therefore rp from that.  It would be nice however to create book with real text to the book, and therefore give the reader the requisite knowledge gained from the book, and therefore no have to tell them ooc what they just were supposed to have learned.
How about something in between? Blank 'books' that you can add your own text too? Then reading it and turning the pages. Effectivly, you could copy and paste an entire segment you want and *poof*
Slant by Greg Bear is a pretty good novel to read... as are Poul Anderson's Total Recall and L. Ron Hubbard's Final Blackout (definitely not cyberpunk but it is my vision of the Badlands)... another good book to read is Farenheit 451 by Ray Bradbury...

*ponders further* I'll post more as I think of other novels.. there are so many that I've read..



L Ron Hubbard stuff is all full of hidden messages and sub concious nasties. Read with caution. Hmmm...


Heh..   I'm Wiccan.. I like good reading.. does it really matter? I mean.. most of his Mission Earth deca.. deco.. shit ten-book series was full of sex and drugs but hey.. if that's a part of scientology, goody for them...
I personally think Heinlein's The Moon is a Harsh Mistress and The Cat Who Walks Through Walls
are both great works of fiction that give insight into what going Orbital must be like..
Continuing the book topic.

I just finished Redrobe, the sequel to Remix by John Courtney Grimwood. Both books are pretty damn good cyberpunk reads. I recommend them to anyone who can find them, as I think they are currently only available in the UK. Fortunately, delivers to the states :)

Tad Williams. He's got some good ones that are cyberpunky. The 'Otherland' series springs to mind. Liked the first one, started the second, but couldn't get into it. In fact, I can't seem to get into any books right now. Phoo. Must be in the water.
I second that notion, John Courtney Grimwood. Almost finished ReMix which I happened across in a Chapters here in lil ol' Canuckiland.

John Courtney Grimwood - what the critics say:-

Vicious, blackly-witty, violent.
Tarantino transported to the 22nd Century.
Fiction so trendy you can wear it.
William Gibson meets Quentin Tarantino.

Other books by this author -
Lucifer's Dragon (*cough*, not you, Luc)

See also


You just managed to mention both Robert A. Heinlein and L. Ron Hubbard consecutively...

Anyway.. Gibson is excellent, as is Neal Stephenson. I'd recommend Gibson's first trilogy along with Burning Chrome, and for Stephenson Snowcrash and perhaps The Diamond Age... Cryptonomicon was excellent, but has little to nothing to do with Cyberpunk, whereas Zodiac I found to be a mite bit dull.
We mustn't forget Masamune Shirow's Ghost in the Shell Manga ... it goes much more in-depth than the movie did, really excellent reading.. GUNNM, also, is worth looking over, on the anime front.


I love that manga.. unfortunately I've only been able to come across the dark horse comics trade paperback.. I am a fucking HUGE fan of GITS.. even collect the little Kusanagi figures and such..

Yeah I know.. my life sucks.. but..

Ta-dah! Shirow has completed GITS 2: Man-Machine Interface... can't wait to get my hands on it... it's been in the makes for something round five years now...

Chuck Palahiuk (Fight Club) has recently releaseda new book, "Choke".  I haven't had time to read it yet, especially since it hit bookstores only last week, but I expect it will be a worthwhile read.  

Additionally, I think i need to bitch-slap Nic for bringing L.Ron Hubbard onto my literary discussion.  

Back to the topic, why are we limiting our thoughts about literature to books that deal only with cyberpunk issues/culture?  Should we not diversify into books that may more fully devlop the psychological or social issues of the dome?  What about something like Oliver Twist to discuss the wealth/poverty/abandonment issues that reds feel?

Damn, gaston beat me tot he GITS2 post :P
You want to discuss Oliver Twist and how it relates to a late 21st civilization. I suddenly feel like I'm in lit 101 with Mrs. Ewing.
OK, so maybe not necesarrily Oliver Twist, but what about Plato's Republic?  Is it possible that by the late 21st century we will have been able to genetically engineer the guardians that he discussed as the ultimate rulers of a society?  This is something i tried to discuss IC with several other players, but unfortunately no one else had any knowledge of the subject.
And equally unfortunate, I stopped taking lit for a reason. I don't enjoy discussing it ;)
Hmmmm... Huxley's A Brave New World might prove useful, as well as Orson Well's frightening novel 1984... King's novella The Running Man, off which the classic Arny movie was based, is another read I'd suggest.  The novel A Clockwork Orange is another suggested read, as well as Dante's Divine Comedy, seeing as one might envision the Dome as Dante's hell in reverse, in which one must climb up in order to reach the very bowels of the Inferno..

More to come..

Whoa... how'd GITS2 slip by me? I've only had the chance to see the first one once, but it made a lasting impression. I've gone to quite a few sites on the net looking for GITS stuff to bring up ideas for new code or RP on elseMOOs many times. I'm assuming that GITS2 is in the movie format, neh? Is it available as a book as well? Thanks.
Sorry chummer.. GITS2 is only a manga... and it -still- hasn't made it to US soil.


Might I suggest going to [html][/html]?  It has an entire host of links for GITS2..
Holy shit!  My facts are waaaaay off! GITS2: MMI is coming out 28 June 2001 in A5 manga format!
oh yeah, A5 manga format, I get everything on that now, hell I don;t even use DVD's just A5 manga.  I go to the grocery store, meat counter, "hey can I get a couple of ribeye's, yeah..why don;t you give them to me in A5 manga format."    WTF?
I'd say that's a good idea, but I fucking hate Dickens. *shudder*
A5 is the size of the book. close to 11*17 I think. Or was that A4?
The sad thing is is that this kinda sounds like some old school 'l33t' hacker talk.

Burn sez
leave b 4
u r expunged.

Chant quotz
lame wanaB
hac|<3r MooV
1 |33t d00d!
did you just use 2 different forms of the real letter B?  shame in you.

*goes to spank Johnny*

*then thinks better of it as NIN's Perfect Drug comes on in his IRL background*

Whooo!!! That musta been trippy ^_^

*cackles and runs into wall*

Interesting that Heinlein was mentioned... �one of the best Sci-Fi authors to have ever lived, AND a Libertarian if there ever was one, hehe...

Heinlein's work isn't cyberpunk, but it's DAMN good. �I got a huge collection last Christmas, still reading through them... but whenever I want a good read, I know I can find it on that shelf.

Any future history stories are awesome.
Stranger in a Strange Land is almost my favorite.
Time Enough for Love is my favorite, and is also a future history novel (the last, I believe). It's also where my name, Lazarus, comes from.


Heinlein's last work was To Sail Beyond The Sunset, and it tells the tail of Laz Long's mother as she was growing up, explaining the disappearance of her father during WWI(I ?), and her part in said disappearance, as well as a whole slew of info on the Long family lineage.  It's a good read, if anything.

Just my 2 pesos worth.

Hmmm...not CP novel, but fucking good anyway.

American Gods by Neil Gaiman

It's new.  I just finished it.  I couldn't put it down.  I reccomend it to everyone.

It's out? finally?


Maybe since my last name is Long, I'll become famous and be in some book and live to be like 3000 years old!!!!!

*cackles with an insane glee*
*runs into wall with a rather sick-sounding result*

Ever notice how in games and books that are semi-oriental, there are a lot of "Long"s in them? They tend to be boss-guys or evil-guys. Interesting.

Since we're on novels I've always had this question. If anyone's ever read the 'Sword of Shanarah' one of the series the group is walking through a forest and come upon old steel girder soon as i read it i thought 'ooh, is this a fictional future of current day earth' cuz those are always cool to think about...

but anyway, that was the only mention I ever caught about it. Giving the post-apocolyptic view to a fantasy novel was kinda cool, anyone have any idea on that?

[and chant....if yer an evil-boss trying to control the worl...can I be your henchmen? I'll be the one guy in the oriental film that doesn't know any MA and i'll have like metal arms and jagged teeth or something. You can call me Slug]

Absolutely, I remember that part vividly. It gave me goosebumps when I realized it was 'future-past'. Kinda shadowrun style "world awakening" back to it's magical roots kinda thing.

Then again, it coulda been the ruined remains of some gnomes forge ;)

Goosebumps. Ditto...but ya had to go and ruin it with gnome forges! Bah! :P

There needs to be a future-past/post-apocolyptic/fantasy/cyberpunk/MOO somewhere...

*codes one up*

No, it definately wan't a Gnome's forge... Because later in the book, the "druid" explains the history of the world, how hundreds of years ago, man had become the strongest race, had nearly conquered disease, had ways of doing almost anything.

Then a world war or something happened...

I won't spoil the rest, but as you can see it wasn't a Gnome's forge.

Edit: actually, you probaly already knew that, but for those who haven't read the book and don't recognize Johnny's sarcasm, then there ya go.

(Edited by Jadael at 7:06 pm on Nov. 15, 2001)

normally I try to avoid picking on people, but I just read this thread, and saw the author of 1984 listed as Orson Wells.  This was bothersome in and of itself, but what disturbed me even more was that I seemed to be the only one who noticed.  While Orson Wells may have been a great actor, and the man behind the "War of The Worlds" radio play, George Orwell wrote the classic dystopian vision of the future, "1984."

Meanwhile, has anyone read John Shirley's "A Song Called Youth" series: Eclipse, Eclipse: Corona, and Eclipse: Penumbra?  All three very interesting reads.

Super Toys All Summer Long.

Compilation in which the similarly-titled novella behind the movie, AI, can be found.

Just my extra two cents.

*pets the search feature*


Mmmmm, woefully out of date webpages. Much like too much of the SD site!
If the websit is really dowqn then you should give this friend of mine a call, he does good maintenance.
Quote: from Johnny on 4:29 pm on Nov. 3, 2004[br]Mmmmm, woefully out of date webpages. Much like too much of the SD site!

you mean it's not 1997?

*puts away the "Prepare for the coming millennium!" survival kit and wanders off*

I don't think anyone mentioned Bruce Sterling..  I'm only halfway through two of his books.. but he's pretty damn CP.   I recomend 'Heavy Weather'. The furture it takes place in is alot like what Gibson painted in Neuromancer, Virtual Light, etc.
Heh, and two years later, I just finished Heavy Weather.  I'm reading Count Zero right now.


I also finally finished Snow Crash, via audio book.  I had to download the Audiobook because I was usuing the actual book as a mouse pad.  It was excellent.

Slow reader... ;P
I remember when I first read Neuromancer about.. seven or  eight years ago. I basically went on a  binge and read nearly all of his other books. 'Difference Engine' didn't captivate my attention for long enough.

As for Stephenson, I really liked Snow Crash of course. Especially its depiction of things like that cube where what's his face, Hiro the Protaganist is it? Lives and ends up having to ditch... that whole viral/cypher thing spreading around the Matrix... the anonymity of the whole thing... then moving on to a wild tangent about Sumerian cuniform... I still remember certain passages vividly since its that kind of book.

I did read pseudo-historical thriller Cryptonomicon. which was mildly entertaining if only because it promised something, but never really delivered it.

I guess I should look at more of Sterling's stuff. Haven't really paid enough attention there.

Snow Crash was a great book, I originaly put it down when it started to get into the religious shit, because I just wasn't interested.. but it ended up being good when I listened to the unabridged audio book.

I have the feeling that the book kinda got away from him.  It had a really strong start, and a great finish, but.. in the middle it gets kinda jumbled.

Maybe you guys could explain something.  In the first part of the book, it seems like there are two seperate timelines going on.

When Hiro crashes, and YT takes the pizza.

Then at some point later when YT calls Hiro cause she got busted.

Then it jumps back to Hiro getting out of the car and escaping the Burbclave.  

Then to several weeks later when Hiro is in the U-Stor-It and talks about YT being his partner for awhile now..

That confused the fuck out of me.

Altered Carbon, by Richard K. Morgan.  It's a great first book, and many, many concepts you find therein will be appealing to those of you who are used to the world of Sindome.  Thus far it's caught my attention.
Just picked up Richard K. Morgan's second Takeshi Kovacs novel, Broken Angels.  It looks promising.  I'll give you an update once I finish re-reading Greg Bear's Slant.



have been drinking gibson novels like koolaid. virtual light, idoru, almost done with neuromancer. have the sequels. just wish i had a palm device to read e-book style in bed :p
Altered Carbon and Broken Angels, both Takeshi Kovacs novels by Phillip K. Morgan.

Both books are awesome.. the second one even goes into the Voodoo/LoA which makes me happy..

The writers style, is incredible and hard to explain but you'll think in the back of your mind that he must have played Sindome.  Seriously, I think he might have.  Which one of you is him?  Don't lie to me now.. I know your here..

Holy old post Batman!!
Okay. Read both of those books. And got a hold of Woken Furies.  All three are nice. I'm liking his style, but it isn't just CP.  Still great work, though.



I'd like to also add one other work to the pile:

Frank Miller's Hard Boiled, which is a loose interpretation of Dick's The Electronic Ant [Wikipedia].



Is Wokken Furies a Takeshi Kovacs novel?  I have a feeling it isn't but I'm not sure..

Ah, it is a Takeshi Kovacs novel, and I'm sorry, it's Richard K. Morgan, not Phillip K. Morgan.  Getting my authors (Phillip K. Dick) confused!
speaking of Phillip K Dick, the 'A Scanner Darkly' movie was really good.

and now i'm seeing the graphic effect in geico commercials.. o.O